gods, tech, bonus, temple New tech for temples - Dedicate it to the gods

[Lion.Kanzen]

By the way with Seleucid.

what about the mountain called Nemrut?

Quote

The mountain lies 40 km (25 mi) north of Kahta, near Adıyaman. In 62 BC, King Antiochus I Theos of Commagene built on the mountain top a tomb-sanctuary flanked by huge statues 8–9-metre-high (26–30 ft) of himself, two lions, two eagles and various Greek, Armenian, and Medes gods, such as Zeus-Aramazd or Oromasdes (associated with Zoroastrian god Ahura Mazda), Hercules-Vahagn, Tyche-Bakht, and Apollo-Mihr-Mithras. These statues were once seated, with names of each god inscribed on them. The heads of the statues have at some stage been removed from their bodies, and they are now scattered throughout the site.

The pattern of damage to the heads (notably to noses) suggests that they were deliberately damaged as a result of iconoclasm. The statues have not been restored to their original positions. The site also preserves stone slabs with bas-relief figures that are thought to have formed a large frieze. These slabs display the ancestors of Antiochus, who

 

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

 

On 8/17/2017 at 9:23 PM, Hannibal_Barca said:

As for the "poor choice" of gods, I try to choose a fitting god for each civilization, meaning for example although Apollo is revered in Sparta a lot, he is mainly a god of archery, poetry and music so I opted instead for his sister Artemis (in this case with an epithet)

 

The Spartans revered music and poetry as much as the Athenians did. Why? Because learning these things sharpened one's mind for war, of course. So, Apollo's special effect could be Tyrtean Paeans, which help their hoplites move faster.

[Hannibal_Barca]

11 hours ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

By the way with Seleucid.

what about the mountain called Nemrut?

 

I think this only strengthens the argument that not all.seleucid gods should be greek

I emphasize again, the choice of gods does not have to be which was the most popular (although if we talk about within the same religion then yes), players should be allowed to choose a lesser religion too

 

 

 

9 hours ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

 

The Spartans revered music and poetry as much as the Athenians did. Why? Because learning these things sharpened one's mind for war, of course. So, Apollo's special effect could be Tyrtean Paeans, which help their hoplites move faster.

Good argument, eliminates 1 of the war gods, 3 is too many anyway (replace Aphrodite)

 

 

[Hannibal_Barca]

Sparta's most important temple was that of Artemis Orthia; its most important festival was dedicated to Hyacinthus; as for the third, Ares was not really worshipped in Sparta (although he was respected as a decent warrior; in Athens he was just despised as a weak troublemaker); maybe include the war goddess Athena, who had an old temple in Sparta

 

The epithet Orthia means only from Mount Orthium.. as its the same goddess I see no harm in making her useful

 

Hyacinthus was the mortal male lover of Apollo (no discrimination there)

At best he is a divine hero, not a god

And what would you benefit from his patronage? Flowers grow faster?

 

I'll consider Athena as a replacement for Ares

[Hannibal_Barca]

While Artemis Orthia might also be a hybrid of deities I am still unconvinced

Also, I have read in several places that Ares as the god of war is highly respected and revered in Sparta

They might all be false but there is also the chance that your information could be faulty

[Nescio]

1 hour ago, Hannibal_Barca said:

I think this only strengthens the argument that not all.seleucid gods should be greek

I emphasize again, the choice of gods does not have to be which was the most popular (although if we talk about within the same religion then yes), players should be allowed to choose a lesser religion too

The source quoted clearly states “62 BC” (by which time the Seleucid empire no longer existed) and king “of Commagene” (a minor Armenian kingdom on the Euphrates).

And again, I'd like to emphasize there was a continuum of cults without distinct religions. Besides, “Hellinized” does not mean “Greek”; local gods were equated with Greek equivalents, and vice versa; non-Greek gods assumed some Greek elements, iconography, names, etc and Greek cults incorporated foreign elements. This is nothing special and happens all the time, everywhere; most “Greek” gods were actually pre-Greek, by the way.

EDIT: the deities named in that source actually support Hellenization: Zeus-Aramazd, Hercules-Vahagn, Tyche-Bakht, Apollo-Mihr-Mithras.

1 hour ago, Hannibal_Barca said:

Hyacinthus was the mortal male lover of Apollo (no discrimination there)

At best he is a divine hero, not a god

And what would you benefit from his patronage? Flowers grow faster?

In literary sources (e.g. Ovid), yes. However, in Lakedaimon (Sparta) he was an old (predating Apollo) and very important fertility god and associated with youth and the Spring; as for the benefit, maybe a movement speed bonus.

Again, keep in mind religion was local (every city/town/village/community had its own pantheon, cults, mythology), individual (every person had his own beliefs and could decide for his own which gods to worship and in which rituals to participate), and inclusive (worshipping specific gods does not exclude others; existence of other deities was never denied; mutually contradicting versions of myths could be and were held simultaneously without anyone objecting).

1 hour ago, Hannibal_Barca said:

Also, I have read in several places that Ares as the god of war is highly respected and revered in Sparta

Yes, I never denied this, in fact I stated that myself as well (“he was respected as a decent warrior”). However, being respected and revered is something different than being worshipped with his own cult and sanctuary. Show me evidence of just one Ares temple or festival in Sparta and I'm convinced.

1 hour ago, Hannibal_Barca said:

They might all be false but there is also the chance that your information could be faulty 

Keep in mind Wikipedia c.s. are not reliable sources. In case you're interested in religion in Antiquity, Religions of the Ancient World : a guide (Belknap/HUP: Cambridge, MA 2004) is a decent starting point.

Edited August 19, 2017 by Nescio
source quoted

[Lion.Kanzen]

Spoiler

Ok this will be the base for Mars, I'm not sure if make a mosaic. Like Alexander vs Persian or like Anphorae style.

Ares will be like the image from Anphorae.

[Hannibal_Barca]

14 hours ago, Nescio said:

The source quoted clearly states “62 BC” (by which time the Seleucid empire no longer existed) and king “of Commagene” (a minor Armenian kingdom on the Euphrates).

And again, I'd like to emphasize there was a continuum of cults without distinct religions. Besides, “Hellinized” does not mean “Greek”; local gods were equated with Greek equivalents, and vice versa; non-Greek gods assumed some Greek elements, iconography, names, etc and Greek cults incorporated foreign elements. This is nothing special and happens all the time, everywhere; most “Greek” gods were actually pre-Greek, by the way.

EDIT: the deities named in that source actually support Hellenization: Zeus-Aramazd, Hercules-Vahagn, Tyche-Bakht, Apollo-Mihr-Mithras.

In literary sources (e.g. Ovid), yes. However, in Lakedaimon (Sparta) he was an old (predating Apollo) and very important fertility god and associated with youth and the Spring; as for the benefit, maybe a movement speed bonus.

Again, keep in mind religion was local (every city/town/village/community had its own pantheon, cults, mythology), individual (every person had his own beliefs and could decide for his own which gods to worship and in which rituals to participate), and inclusive (worshipping specific gods does not exclude others; existence of other deities was never denied; mutually contradicting versions of myths could be and were held simultaneously without anyone objecting).

Yes, I never denied this, in fact I stated that myself as well (“he was respected as a decent warrior”). However, being respected and revered is something different than being worshipped with his own cult and sanctuary. Show me evidence of just one Ares temple or festival in Sparta and I'm convinced.

Keep in mind Wikipedia c.s. are not reliable sources. In case you're interested in religion in Antiquity, Religions of the Ancient World : a guide (Belknap/HUP: Cambridge, MA 2004) is a decent starting point.

Although the quoted source states an inconvenient date Zoroastrianism is by no means that young

It was already securely established even before that time.

In any case, Zoroastrianism was known in the Seleucid Empire

 

While Hellenized doesn't mean Greek I'll just refer using that so as not to cause difficulties for non-native english speakers, people unacquainted with history and people with a shifty sense of comprehension.

As for Hyacinth, even though he might have been a deity in Sparta, I'd pass over him as I think well have enough movement bonus stuff anyway

As wow suggested apollo with movement bonus first that shall be chosen

 

 

 

Of course noone denied the existence of other gods, keep in mind that with this tech we are only choosing a preferred god, patron god of your village (no matter how many times we state empire, it will always be a village god)

Ok town at best

 

I don't trust wikipedia, hence I try to check other sites (many of which are themselves based on wikipedia)

I admire your source, I might find another reliable source to double check yours once I get to a reliable connection with something better than my mobile

 

I might not be able to show you a temple to Ares but as I have stated that is not a reason why there shouldn't be

[Hannibal_Barca]

Also I'm making a separate conversation for a few who will be putting this whole thing together ( @elexis, @Tiber7, @Lion.Kanzen and myself so far)

Any who wish to see this feature added to the game should say so and be included

Of course the conversation here will continue but main stuff will be discussed there