Greetings

[jonbaer]

While I have enjoyed every single mod that has come along (or that I have since discovered), one thing I wish did not happen is that a mod was inclusive of a collection of civ(s) and that as a developer/artist there was some type of "Civ Development Kit" for 0ad.  This way people can come along and delve into a Civ w/ an easier path (or at least push one w/o it affecting anything else).  There is an enormous challenge in balancing and even separating the 12 civs already in the game but at some point it would still be nice to go to a repository somewhere and view all available civs in a tree directory w/ READMEs, docs, etc.  The drawback of course being that every civ would need to be tested back against the HEAD copy of the game for incompatibilities, etc.

[Stan`]

When I was really active around here I actually had all the non gameplay related mods workinf together so ponies vs chinese vs vikings vs caro vs egyptians. This is doable.

[Lion.Kanzen]

Vs Thracians...

can be nice create a project with more faction and mini-factions no right now. But our expansions pack start as Mod > DLC > Expansion.

 

but who are interested in new factions must create a document desing with high quiality and even have building rooster concept ( art) if they have at last have the possibility to seen a faction in 0 A.D " Beyond " first release. (1.0 V) or Beyond the second part.

[GunChleoc]

@Orpheuis: The best way to get something added to a FLOSS project is to help making it. Simply demanding something will get you nowhere, because developing anything at all will take a long time. If adding the Tracians is that important to you, prove it by helping to create them. Once you have a working Mod, we can take it from there.

[jonbaer]

This is almost what I am saying, it should be easier for him to fill in the blanks of a new Civ somehow, by the time he finished ranting he would have been ~40% complete w/ templates by now ;-) ... I know the 3D modeling / textures / sounds are more than half the battle but his knowledge of history and effort to write a well thought out post has to be worth compiling somewhere I think.  I don't know the full developmental history of the game to recommend anything though, just pointing out what I think might help other people tackle Civ development in the future.  I also don't know if it's technically possibly to develop Civs independently like that but my guess is from the mods I have seen it should be (and was designed as such).

What I think would be nice to have is something like @ https://github.com/0admods where there is a civ-athens (or civ-developer-kit) project that might be an extracted Civ to show what is involved in generating such a mod.

[sanderd17]

@jonbaer, the Rise of the East (han_china) mod started development under some modders who were also part of the main team (though the current maintainers have added a lot more content to it).

The work on the mod was started way before the civ list was finalised, and one of the reasons to not include the China civ in the main game (which would have been quite convenient then) was to have a showcase for how to add a civ through a mod. The mod doesn't implement the strict minimum needed to add a civ, but it's still minimal enough to see what's needed.

And our civs are based on these design documents: http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Design_Document#PlayableCivilizations So you'd need something like that, and ofc art references to work from.

[Lion.Kanzen]

@feneur can be nice the team take decision in order to avoid this situations, this may be announce the team don't add any other faction and those want add , can create a mod first like RoE to adding and then may be will considerate in a far future( very far)

evrn the reason can be enlisted, and if some body creates a method to create one civ in document can be nice and warning the minimum  requirements to make a civ/faction.

council of mods follows the main team method and RoE method to create mod. 

 

[Orpheus]

Hello,

It is so nice and warm to be here : )
Imagine this was Microsoft and Age of Empires ... what I would be able to do then? Nothing.

This is the power of open source. It will allow us to have best RTS ever while enjoying the process.

I did not say that I want Thracians added immediately for the next alpha. No rush here. Lets do quality instead. I just wanted an approval and a green light from the community so I can contribute my bit.
As I said earlier I can propose and provide everything related to the civ except actual graphics as I am not designer. I am sure I will not be left alone in this endeavor and others will join.

@Lion.Kanzen - I have in front of me the book called The thracian language by akad. Georgiev so those people spoke own language and had own writings. Although this language is "dead" now many of their words can be found in the modern bulgarian language so have no worries about the voices.

Example:
πέλτη - light shield covered with skin used by thracians
ῥομφαία - thracian spear or sword
σκάρκη - thracian silver coin
diza - fortress
dama - house
deba - city
asdule - horseman, rider

Thracian holly place Parmak Kaya with trapezium-shaped bays, falic symbol and a cave:

Thracian religious structure from 1000 B.C. 34meters in size. In the center there is round cult camera 11.6 meters in diameter and 5.5meters in height. Scientists say there is no analog to this as architecture and building technology in pre-Roman and Roman eras.

Thracian temple built 100 A.D. and rebuilt 400 A.D.

By the way I support the idea of Chinese faction and even Korean and Japanese ones. They differ enough from each other (and the other civs) and have well documented history of endless wars between them. But let's do one thing at the time.

Thank you for your time!

Edited May 18, 2016 by Orpheus

[Lion.Kanzen]

@Orpheus you can start a document , is open source project , you are right but we/you need manpower, if you visit art department wecare lacking from several artists.

 

create a new civilization/ Faction isn't easy, can  take years, evenn your photos isn't enough .

 

You need the voices

Need art style concept.

Need create all set of units, the forbidden and the champions.

 

[Orpheus]

Thank you @Lion.Kanzen this is helpful, I am going to do my homework now and also will form Thracian civ team : )

The gray area is Thracia 1600 B.C.:

Edited May 18, 2016 by Orpheus

[Lion.Kanzen]

And don't forget 

the last Hellenic/sucesor factions were made or started as mod project.

 

[feneur]

We can certainly communicate it better, but we have already made the decision to not include more factions. There is however plenty of room for mods that adds new factions and there could be some kind of "expansion" that adds more as well.

Keep in mind that the first release will focus on the period between 500 B.C. to 1 B.C. so for factions which are meant to be played with the first release they should also focus on these years. If there is no perfect wonder within these years it works to use an older one that would still be standing. 

[jonbaer]

@Orpheus From my own experience, I have created a mod w/ 2 factions, this is what I would do, you should look at a template for one of the other factions, ie http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Civ%3A_Athenians and fill out as much info as possible, this can even take a long time, when you have it filled out I am sure someone can template what you have w/ the Athenians so that your civ is playable in your own mod and then you can slowly fill it out from there, I am sure that is how the other mods (Hans, Millenium, Ariesta, etc) started out.  Once you add something new everyday it builds up + I am sure will be playable + enjoyable.

[Orpheus]

Hey @jonbaer, I was thinking in this direction : ) Thank you for clarifying it for me.

It seems many of the very important archaeological discoveries about the Thracians are made in the last 10-15 years. After one night of documentaries on the subject I am even more amazed from this civilization. For example:

First info about them - 5500 B.C.
Oldest golden and silver items found in the world.
First metal dishes, plates and tools.
Best mining with mines up to 2000 people and 500 meters deep.
Precise stone structures where cut stones 60 tones heavy can be found. The stone city Perperikon - built and cut entirely into a rock.
Dolmens and Stonehenge like structures.
Invention and first use of baked bricks.
Heavily rely on evolved farming with seed cultures which can not be found in the Europe's wild life and are import from Asia.
One of the six places in the world where animal breeding will emerge independently.
Hunting with hunting dogs.
Established merchant routes and wide diplomacy. They import copper bars with ships on 2000 km route from Cyprus island.
Single type advanced ship fit all needs.

See what Omir say in "Iliad" about the ally of the Trojans - thracian king Rhesus:
"Rhesus, son of Eioneus, is their royal leader. He has the tallest, finest horses I ever saw, whiter than snow and fast as the wind. His chariot is finely worked in gold and silver, and he brought his gold armour with him, huge and wondrous to look on. It is armour fit for a deathless god, not a mere mortal. So, take me to your swift ship, or bind me as tight as you wish and leave me here, then you can quickly prove whether I tell true or no.’"

And much more : ) I can see already how perfectly Thracians will fit the Game.

 

12 hours ago, feneur said:

Keep in mind that the first release will focus on the period between 500 B.C. to 1 B.C. so for factions which are meant to be played with the first release they should also focus on these years. If there is no perfect wonder within these years it works to use an older one that would still be standing. 

The modern, influential and diplomatic thracian king Sevt III the Immortal with his Sevtopolis and his mound twice the size of the one of Philip II of Macedon is 400 B.C.
Spartacus is 71 B.C.

so we will come with something good : )

Edited May 19, 2016 by Orpheus

[jonbaer]

The depth part on the mining is very interesting.  While I doubt it will be part of the game soon, mine depth would be nice to explore, I had no idea that oil exploitation went so far back until I read on the ancient Chinese bit ... http://csegrecorder.com/articles/view/ancient-chinese-drilling (as I wanted to add oil as a resource using this mod (https://github.com/0ADMods/resource_agnostic) but was not sure if it made much sense).  It sounds like the Thracians would have a nice "technology" line in the later phases, I think between developing the templates, the technology tree, and balancing you will be very busy.

[Lion.Kanzen]

The Thracian have influence by many cultures but... they have heavy Hellenistic in there

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seuthopolis

Spoiler

Seuthopolis (Ancient Greek: Σευθόπολις) was an ancient hellenistic-type^[1] city founded^[2] by the Thracian king Seuthes III, and the capital of the Odrysian kingdom. The city was founded sometime from 325 BC to 315 BC.^[3] It was a city, built on the site of an earlier settlement, and its ruins are now located at the bottom of the Koprinka Reservoir near Kazanlak, Stara Zagora Province, in central Bulgaria.

Seuthopolis was not^[4] a true polis, but rather the seat of Seuthes and his court. His palace had a dual role, functioning also as a sanctuary of the Cabeiri, the gods of Samothrace.^[5] Most of the space within the city was occupied not by homes but by official structures, the majority of the people living outside the city. It had Thracian and Greek populace.^[6] In 281 BC it was sacked by Celts.^[7]

 

 

The city of Seuthopolis was found in 1948, at the bottom of a lake in Bulgaria...The city had existed since 320 BC, originally the capital of the Odrysian kingdom , a union of Thracian tribes. It was located at the bottom of a valley, apparently, when a dam broke, filling the region with water, creating a lake. The city sat, in its underwater grave for years, until Bulgarian archaeologists discovered that it was one of the best preserved Thracian sites in the country.Now, they're undertaking a massive amount of work to unearth the city... a circular dam has been proposed,…